Comments on: How complicated is your language? http://erikras.com/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/ Thoughts and photos from an American living in Spain. Fri, 10 Feb 2012 07:32:00 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Heather http://erikras.com/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1823 Heather Mon, 28 Jan 2008 13:24:24 +0000 http://www.erik-rasmussen.com/blog/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1823 Hmmm I liked that....... Simon I think the reason why Japanese is least as far as proofing is because it's a tonal language, which would be slightly hard to convey on paper in my opinion....... I always thought some things were just better said in Spanish, so much so that I'll still say those certain things in spanish just because there are no words in the English language that can explain it well enough...... Hmmm I liked that……. Simon I think the reason why Japanese is least as far as proofing is because it’s a tonal language, which would be slightly hard to convey on paper in my opinion…….

I always thought some things were just better said in Spanish, so much so that I’ll still say those certain things in spanish just because there are no words in the English language that can explain it well enough……

]]> By: simon http://erikras.com/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1822 simon Mon, 28 Jan 2008 10:25:47 +0000 http://www.erik-rasmussen.com/blog/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1822 Italian more complex than Japanese? Those two file sizes are the ones that stand out as least representative (to me) of the reality of those languages. Paola tried to learn Japanese once. Three writing systems, adjectives which have to agree with the verb tense, numerous number systems, depending on what it is you're counting... Italian more complex than Japanese? Those two file sizes are the ones that stand out as least representative (to me) of the reality of those languages. Paola tried to learn Japanese once. Three writing systems, adjectives which have to agree with the verb tense, numerous number systems, depending on what it is you’re counting…

]]> By: Erik R. http://erikras.com/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1821 Erik R. Mon, 28 Jan 2008 09:07:03 +0000 http://www.erik-rasmussen.com/blog/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1821 Wow, sgazzetti! Whenever I dangle these "look at me, I'm bilingual!" posts out there, you chomp down on them with rigorous factual linguistic information. I love it. I suspect that my screenshot really has very little to say about the actual languages and a lot to say about Microsoft's (and their corporate clients') desire for proper proofing tools. I just spent an hour reading that entire New Yorker article on the Pirahã. Fascinating stuff. It reminded me of that Mark Twain quotation, which I have on a t-shirt, "All generalizations are false, including this one." Again, superb comment. Wow, sgazzetti! Whenever I dangle these “look at me, I’m bilingual!” posts out there, you chomp down on them with rigorous factual linguistic information. I love it.

I suspect that my screenshot really has very little to say about the actual languages and a lot to say about Microsoft’s (and their corporate clients’) desire for proper proofing tools.

I just spent an hour reading that entire New Yorker article on the Pirahã. Fascinating stuff. It reminded me of that Mark Twain quotation, which I have on a t-shirt, “All generalizations are false, including this one.”

Again, superb comment.

]]> By: sgazzetti http://erikras.com/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1820 sgazzetti Mon, 28 Jan 2008 07:18:36 +0000 http://www.erik-rasmussen.com/blog/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1820 I'm with Jane. In theory your idea sounds like it would have at least some general validity, but I think it rests on a shaky premise (<i>"Obviously there will be differences in how much time and effort Microsoft has spent..."</i>). Also, knowing something about both languages, I have difficulty with the idea that Italian is 50% more complex than Spanish. Generally speaking, linguists consider all languages (with <a href="http://tinyurl.com/23ck8t" rel="nofollow">very rare exceptions</a> at either end of the bell curve) roughly equivalent in terms of 'richness', variety, expressiveness, etc. The English lexicon is larger than that of many other languages because it is a very 'promiscuous' language, borrowing readily from all of the many languages it comes into contact with. But the main result of this is simply that we are relatively rich in synonyms. My English-Slovene dictionary is twice as thick as my Slovene-English volume from the same publisher, but that doesn't mean that English is twice as complicated, just that we have more ways of saying the same thing. If we trust Microsoft (and your theory) on this, we have to conclude that German is 10 times more 'complicated' than Japanese. And linguistically speaking, that's not gonna wash. More to the point concerning relative difficulty among languages are cultural considerations that are very difficult to describe, let alone quantify -- have some native speaker of Arabic explain to you why 'tree trunk' and 'motorist' (obviously) come from the same etymological root and you'll see what I mean. See also <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sapir-Whorf_hypothesis" rel="nofollow">Sapir-Whorf Hypothesis</a> -- though largely discredited (or just out of fashion), still germane. I’m with Jane. In theory your idea sounds like it would have at least some general validity, but I think it rests on a shaky premise (“Obviously there will be differences in how much time and effort Microsoft has spent…”). Also, knowing something about both languages, I have difficulty with the idea that Italian is 50% more complex than Spanish.

Generally speaking, linguists consider all languages (with very rare exceptions at either end of the bell curve) roughly equivalent in terms of ‘richness’, variety, expressiveness, etc. The English lexicon is larger than that of many other languages because it is a very ‘promiscuous’ language, borrowing readily from all of the many languages it comes into contact with. But the main result of this is simply that we are relatively rich in synonyms. My English-Slovene dictionary is twice as thick as my Slovene-English volume from the same publisher, but that doesn’t mean that English is twice as complicated, just that we have more ways of saying the same thing. If we trust Microsoft (and your theory) on this, we have to conclude that German is 10 times more ‘complicated’ than Japanese. And linguistically speaking, that’s not gonna wash.

More to the point concerning relative difficulty among languages are cultural considerations that are very difficult to describe, let alone quantify — have some native speaker of Arabic explain to you why ‘tree trunk’ and ‘motorist’ (obviously) come from the same etymological root and you’ll see what I mean.

See also Sapir-Whorf Hypothesis — though largely discredited (or just out of fashion), still germane.

]]> By: jane http://erikras.com/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1819 jane Sat, 26 Jan 2008 20:02:15 +0000 http://www.erik-rasmussen.com/blog/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1819 Hmmmmm. Hmmmmm.

]]> By: Bilingual Blogger http://erikras.com/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1818 Bilingual Blogger Sat, 26 Jan 2008 19:28:07 +0000 http://www.erik-rasmussen.com/blog/2008/01/26/how-complicated-is-your-language/#comment-1818 Interesting topic. I've always considered English an economical language but it's fun to see how it stacks up compared to other languages. Interesting topic. I’ve always considered English an economical language but it’s fun to see how it stacks up compared to other languages.

]]>